11th Feb 2006, 12:45pm
My Garngad Family History
A couple of years ago I became very interested in investigating my family history. I knew that my great grandfather, Hugh Kelly, died in the early 1950s, aged nearly 90 years, at McNeil Street, Hutchesontown, Gorbals. I thought I was going to find a lot of family connections with the Gorbals. Instead, all roads led to Garngad.
Hugh Kelly was born in Meenavoy, Stranorlar, County Donegal in 1866. He moved to Glasgow around 1885 and lodged with his older brother Willie Kelly and family at 27 Villiers Street, Garngad. Hugh married Elizabeth McCormick at St Mungo's RC Church, Townhead on 18 July 1890. Elizabeth McCormick was born in 1863 near Killygordon, Donegal and moved to Scotland in 1864 as an infant with her parents. The McCormicks settled 1st at Carnbroe, a small North Lanarkshire town between Coatbridge and Bellshill. Elizabeth was the 1st born of the family and the McCormicks had 7 other children, all born in Scotland. One was born in Carnbroe, one in Dalziel(Motherwell), one in Mossend, Bellshill, one at Dalmarnock Road, Bridgeton and the last 3 at Turner Street, Garngad. (4 of these children died as infants). After arriving in Scotland in 1864, the McCormicks spent about 8 years moving from job to job in the North Lanarkshire area before finally settling at 32 Turner Street, Garngad around 1872. Elizabeth's address is given as 32 Turner St at the time of her marriage to Hugh in 1890.
So where exactly are Turner Street and Villiers Street? Well, they no longer exist! The last time I was home in Glasgow, I purchased an 1894 map of the St Rollox (Townhead, Port Dundas and Garngad) district of Glasgow from the Mitchell library. In 1894, the northern part of Garngad consisted of 4 parallel streets, each running in a south to north direction. Starting from the west, the 4 streets were Turner Street, Villiers Street, Bright Street and Cobden Street. These 4 parallel streets were enclosed on the north by Charles Street and on the south by Garngad Road. Both Charles St and Garngad Road still exist today, though Garngad Road is now called Royston Road. In the late 1800s these 6 congested streets of north Garngad could be described as a 'Little Ireland'. I have studied the 1881, 1891 and 1901 census records at the Mitchell library. About 90% of the households in Turner St, Villiers St, Bright St and Charles St were headed by a person born in Ireland. Cobden St and Garngad Road had more of a mix of Irish and Scottish families. Overall, however, I would say that about 75% of the households in these 6 streets of north Garngad were Irish households.
To the south of Garngad Road was south Garngad. Here there were streets such as Middleton Place, Gourlay Place, Garngadhill, Tharsis Street, Dunolly Street, Rosemount Street and Millburn Street. I didn't study the census records for south Garngad as closely, but from what I could see, there was a good mix of Scottish and Irish families. However, it was clear that south Garngad was not as nearly heavily populated as north Garngad in the late 1800s. I understand that south Garngad became more populated in the early 1900s with the building of many new tenements and the creation of several new streets such as Gadshill Street, Glenbarr Street and Rhymer Street.
After marrying in 1890, Hugh Kelly and Eliza McCormick stayed at 248 Charles Street, Garngad. 248 Charles Street was located betweeen the northern entrances to Turner St and Villiers St. My grandfather, James Kelly, was born there in 1895. The Kelly family moved to a 'better' home at McNeil Street, Hutchesontown, Gorbals around 1910. After fighting in France in the 1st World War, my grandfather, James Kelly, married my grandmother Sarah Rutherford - who came from Stranorlar, Donegal - in the mid 1920s and had 7 children. My grandparents settled 1st in Bright St, Garngad. In the early 1930s they moved to Gadshill St, Garngad where my father, James Kelly, was born in 1934. The family finally settled at Avonspark St, Balornock after the 2nd World War.
In the slum clearances following the 2nd World War, no part of Glasgow was more decimated than Garngad. Many Garngad families were relocated to the new peripheral Glasgow housing schemes such as Easterhouse. (I understand that one of the 1st major slum clearances in Glasgow was carried out in north Garngad as early as 1933!).
My mother's father, Michael Connolly, was born in Clea, Keady, County Armagh in 1893. He came to Glasgow around 1915 and lodged at Garngad Road, Garngad with his relatives - the Moans (or Mones). He married my grandmother Sarah McKenzie - who came from Taylor Street, Townhead - in the early 1920s and had 11 children. My maternal grandparents settled 1st in Bright St, Garngad. In the early 1930s they moved to Dinwiddie St, Germiston, where my mother, Ann Connolly, was born in 1937. The family finally settled at Stamford St, Barrowfield after the 2nd World War.
Many things have been written about the Gorbals. Little in comparison is said about Garngad. It is almost forgotten. The fact that Garngad's name was changed to Royston in 1942 does not help much! It is as if we were meant to forget Garngad. Industrial Glasgow had several Irish ghettoes such as the Gorbals(Hutchesontown), the Calton, parts of Bridgeton and of course Garngad. However, the concentration of Irish families was probably at its highest in Garngad. It has been documented that there was a distinct Garngad accent - half polite, half Irish. Up to the 1950s you could tell someome was from Garngad as soon as they opened their mouth.
My parents met in 1964 and married in 1968. It turned out that my 2 grandmothers knew each other as they had been neighbours at Bright St in the late 1920s and early 1930s. I was born in Garrowhill, Baillieston, Glasgow in 1971 and have lived in Botswana, southern Africa since 1996. (Absence makes the heart grow fonder). Paul Kelly
11th Feb 2006, 02:08pm
Welcome Paul,what a great post , I really enjoyed reading it, excellent historical piece,I do hope it results in some more info for your project.
12th Feb 2006, 09:39pm
What a great piece of nostalgia you have given me with that post. I know every street in that area that you mentioned.
My grandmother lived in Villiers Street, and many school friends lived in Bright Street, Villiers Street and Cobden Street.
I haven't been in the area for over 40 years but I know it's all changed now.
Thanks for the memory
6th May 2006, 01:50pm
It is true that Turner St, Villiers St, and Cobden Street no longer exist. Bright Street still exists though it is not in exactly the same location as the old Bright Street. Charles Street and Royston Road (formerly Garngad Road) both still exist.
The area that you describe as north Garngad now consists of 5 large tower blocks known as the Charles Street flats. The tower blocks are between Charles Street and Royston Road, where Turner, Villiers, Bright and Cobden Streets used to be. The new Bright Street is to the west of the tower blocks.
There is a website known as VIRTUAL MITCHELL. It has many pictures of the old streets of Glasgow. There are pictures of Cobden Street and Garngad Road. The pictures of Cobden Street are very striking. Check it out.
11th May 2006, 05:21pm
My name is David Powell. I am a teacher at Saint Roch's Secondary School in the Gargad - been teaching there since 1972. My mother - Margaret Rodgers - was born in Middleton Place and later lived on Garngadhill. She is 85 and going strong although she has Alzeimer's. She spoke very fondly of the Garngad, especially the Hill, which she described as 'sylvan' even though it was amidst the smoke and smell from all the surrounding factories.
I am putting together A History Wall in the school at present and part of the display will be on the Garngad. I have some cracking photos but could do with a lot more.
The History Wall opening ceremony is on Friday evening, 23rd June 2006 if you are interested.
14th May 2006, 10:35am
Unfortunately I won't be able to attend the Opening of your Wall as I stay overseas. I would love to see it and the old photographs. Is there no way of putting those photographs online? The next time I am home in Glasgow I will definitely come and see it. I am going to inform some of my family members who stay in the Glasgow area about the Opening of the Wall and see if they are interested.
I am also a secondary school teacher. I teach Maths and Statistics at a senior secondary school in Botswana.
Middleton Place is another street which no longer exists! I found it on my old 1894 map or the Garngad area. Middleton Place was pretty much an extension of Turner Street, south of Garngad Road. Turner Street ran in a north to south direction from Charles Street to Garngad Road. The street continued south of Garngad Road down to Garngadhill and was called Middleton Place.
I agree with Angie that the Charles Street high rise flats now occupy the area of north Garngad once occupied by Turner St, Villiers St, Bright St and Cobden St.
Bright Street is the only one of the 4 streets which still exists, though it has been moved about 100 metres west of its old location.
I understand that the Charles Street Flats are enclosed on the west by the 'new' Bright Street, on the east by Garnock Street, on the north by Charles Street and on the south by Royston Road (formerly Garngad Road). Royston Post Office next to the flats is located on what was once Turner Street.
14th May 2006, 12:18pm
I would love to see that wall if I can. I have taken note of the date.
So you are a teacher at my old school? I was a pupil of both St. Roch's Primary and Secondary, Mr Kelly was headmaster when I was there.
I lived the first 23 years of my life in Garngad, my Mother and Father had their first house in Middleton-all gone well before I was born, they also lived in Garngadhill, then Villiers Street and on to Rhymer Street.
I can remember when pretty young--there was a girl named Rodgers from Roystonhill, it's a bit vague but the name Mattie comes to mind for some reason--maybe a relative?
I loved my childhood in that area, they were very happy years.
Thanks for the memories
14th May 2006, 12:58pm
Hi Paul and Valros,
Many of the photographs of Garngad can be found on the following 3 websites: RCAHMS (Royal Commision on the Ancient and Historical Monuments). Use the Canmore database (you will have to register but it's free). Just insert keywords like Gargad, Royston etc. Do the same with the other 2 websites, The Glasgow Story and SCRAN. If you register with Friends Reunited there are lots of people registered when John Kelly was Headmaster as well as a few photos.
Former pupils tell me that John Kelly used to sway backwards and forwards on his feet when he was talking to them - proof positive that he lost his toes in the First World War!
I am developing our school website which has a bit of history in the Aims and Background section. This will be further developed over the next year or so and I will add any copyright free phtos there. The website is found at:
Former pupils like yourself Valros are welcome to attend the opening ceremony of the History Wall. Tickets will be free and there will be a free buffet. If you would like a ticket, email me at the school at: DPowell@st-rochs-sec.glasgow.sch.uk
14th May 2006, 11:19pm
Thank you for your reply David and the site addresses, I will be looking into the St Roch's one regularly!!
I have been registered on Friends Reunited for a few years now and actually got in touch with someone who was a huge part of my childhood and has lived in Canada since 1967.
It is true that Mr Kelly swayed when standing--he was very strict with the boys but more lenient with the girls,but a very fair man.
I still have my school report card with his name on it--now that's a relic ha ha .
I remember hearing a long time back that one of the English teachers became Headmaster after Mr Kelly retired. Not sure if I have the spelling of his name correct but it was Mr Brickley???
He was also a Scout master and on some Sundays the scouts would meet in Rhymer Steet at the "Boys end" of the school, they had a pipe band and it was good to watch.
My Mother's windows looked into the school at the top of Glenbar Street.
Thanks again David
15th May 2006, 06:22am
I am also a former pupil of St Rochs Secondary School,from 1954/57..Mr Kelly was also the headmaster there,during my time,and i have fond memories of him..As Valros says he was a strict,but kind man,and he was always interested in his pupils.
It is true,that he did sway,when talking to you,and always wore boots.it was said he had no toes.
My parents were born in the Garngad,Villiers St to be exact,and were married in St Rochs church,around 1930 i think.
I would dearly love to have a look at the diplay wall,but will look up the website given..many thanks..magsos.
p.s. i was friends with a girl from roystonhill called patricia rodgers..maybe thats the one you mean valros.
Great story from paul kelly.i enjoyed reading about his family history very much.
16th May 2006, 01:11pm
Maybe it was Patricia but Mattie still sticks in my mind--maybe an older sister or relative?
17th May 2006, 02:08am
Hi David and Paul,Loved reading your posts on the garngad i also came from Villiers St and went to St Roch's from 58/61.
David i will check out the school website wish i could be there i live near Boston so i'm afraid i won't make it.Cheers Liz.
Hi Margaret and Val.
17th May 2006, 10:16am
I just wanted to add that I am not related to the former headmaster of St Roch's Secondary School - Mr John Kelly (well I don't think I am). I know that my father, James Kelly (born 1934 Garngad) attended St Roch's Primary School and then St Mungo's Academy, Townhead. I am not sure which schools my grandfather, James Kelly (born 1895 Garngad) attended.
31st May 2006, 09:08pm
Hi Paul and David . First off I would like to say how much info this site has and how good it has been to be able to get to know an area and also a time that I never lived in . Both of my Grandparents came from the area and I`ve been trying for a few years now to find out as much as I can . I would like to say to David that I hope to attend the opening of his memory wall and also bring along my father who was born in the area and is now in his 80`s. so see you all soon . Andy
31st May 2006, 09:33pm
this has been a great read, ill be popping in to see the next episode, good luck paul on finding out more
1st Jun 2006, 08:52am
Good to see someone else having connections with the area.
If I knew your Dad's name I may have heard of him or heard my parents mention the name.
Possibly Lizmac and Magsos too would recognise the name.
What was it you wanted to know about the area as it was ? If I know anything I will certainly tell you.
3rd Jun 2006, 07:00am
Thanks Valros the name of the families are Reidford, Clark and Brown and as far as I can tell the Reidfords lived in 74 Earlston Avenue from the early 1930`s until the 1950`s but the families lived in the area before these dates. The Clark/Brown family had a grocery shop in the area but I dont know its name. Any help would be great as I`ve got family in Canada who are trying to find out more about Garngad.
3rd Jun 2006, 08:16am
My cousin and family lived at 134 Earlston Avenue in the mid to late 50s, I will ask them if they knew any of the names mentioned.
I lived close by myself but didn't know many people in the Avenue.
There were a couple of dairy shops that I can remember in it at that time, one was Anderson's dairy, the other was used much less.
I will post if I find out anything
6th Jun 2006, 10:10am
At the start of the 20th century Glasgow was known as the 2nd city of the British Empire. Only London had a greater population.
Glasgow's population continued to grow and peaked at around 1.1 million in the 1931 census.
In the 1920s, Garngad had the highest population density of any area in the city of Glasgow with people living literally on top of one another. There was no space available for the construction of extra accommodation within the area due to the large number of factories - the very thing that had drawn so many people to the area in the 1st place.
The tenements of old Garngad had been quickly constructed to house the large influx of workers from mainly the northern counties of Ireland. These buildings were of low quality and only had outside communal toilets. Many large families had to stay in single-roomed homes. A few fortunate families stayed in two-roomed dwellings. There was gross overcrowding. Respiratory and lung diseases were rife due to the high levels of pollution from the factories. Mortality rates were high and Garngad's slums were considered to be amongst the worst in Europe. Something had to be done to alleviate the situation.
In 1933, Glasgow's 1st major slum clearance programme of the 20th century was started by the Glasgow Corporation in Garngad. Many of the worst buildings were demolished and new accommodation was built in their place. Some families were rehoused in the newly constructed Garngad tenements, though a large number were rehoused in Germiston, Blackhill and Provanmill, areas to the east of Garngad.
The Blackhill housing scheme opened in 1935. Around 40% of the scheme's original tenants were from Garngad. Blackhill was one of the most notorious housing schemes in Glasgow. It was the home of the late Arthur Thompson and more recently Paul Ferris.
Most of Blackhill was demolished in 1990 to make way for the M80 motorway.
Following the 2nd World War, even more intensive slum clearances were carried out by the Glasgow Corporation. These slum clearances took place in many of the inner city areas of Glasgow:- Garngad (again!), Gorbals, Bridgeton, Calton, Gallowgate, Townhead, Cowcaddens and others.
New housing schemes were built on the periphery of Glasgow- Easterhouse, Castlemilk, Drumchapel, etc - to rehouse people from these areas. The Scottish new towns of East Kilbride, Cumbernauld, Livingston and Irvine were also built.
Many Garngad families were relocated to the new housing schemes in the east and north of Glasgow - Easterhouse, Cranhill, Ruchazie, Barlanark, Garthamlock, Barmulloch etc.
Garngad's name was changed to Royston in 1942.
The slum clearances following the 2nd World War virtually obliterated Garngad's identity. Many old street names had been lost forever. More significantly, most of Garngad's families had gone.
12th Jun 2006, 01:28pm
I was wondering if any of you have ever searched for your Garngad ancestors' birth, marriage and death certificates and census records on the www.scotlandspeople.gov.uk website or at the Mitchell Library. If you have, you would have realised that Garngad or Garngadhill did not exist as a distinct area on official documents in the late 1800s and early 1900s. The streets of Garngad were invariably described as being in the districts of St Rollox, Townhead, Dennistoun or even Springburn.
For example, my grandfather's 1895 birth certificate states that he was born at 248 Charles Street in the district of Dennistoun. Back then, Dennistoun was probably the 'poshest' area in the east end of Glasgow. Although it was to the immediate south east of Garngad, Dennistoun was in many ways a million miles from Garngad.
(Charles St was in fact in north Garngad and wasn't even close to Dennistoun.)
Garngad or Garngadhill only started to appear as a distinct area on official documents in the early 1900s (possibly around 1910).
In the late 1800s, the district of St Rollox usually referred to Garngad, Sighthill (Fountainwell Road) and the northern part of Townhead (around Castle St, Kennedy St, Parliamentary Road, Martyr St and Glebe St).
The southern part of Townhead (around High Street and Glasgow Cross) was in the district of Blackfriars.
Nowadays, Royston (formerly Garngad) and Sighthill are home to many of Glasgow's asylum seekers and refugees. In the early 21st century, just as in the late 19th century, Royston is the first home of many new immigrants to Glasgow.
13th Jun 2006, 02:58pm
If you are interested in reading more about the Garngad area then you should do a GOOGLE search for
ROYSTON ROAD PROJECT HISTORY OF THE AREA
The history section of the Royston Road Project website was written by Jim Friel and contains a lot of information about Garngad/Townhead and the northeast of Glasgow.
TheGlasgowStory website also has information on Garngad, including a photograph from 1925. I would love to know where exactly in Garngad it was taken.
To see the photograph, do a GOOGLE search for
THEGLASGOWSTORY GARNGAD SLUM HOUSING
The photograph can be enlarged.
13th Jun 2006, 10:35pm
Thanks for the information Paul.
I have already read all of Jim Friel's account of the Garngad and it gave vivid memories.
His Father in law was the very first barber to cut my hair, he was known as Joe the barber--Joe Piscane, his shop was on Royston Road.
Haven't looked at the other site but I will
14th Jun 2006, 07:32pm
very interesting ive been reseaching my tree too ,and my mothers family came from parliamentary rd ,always wondered where is was now i know,
14th Jun 2006, 07:47pm
I used to go with my Mother to do shopping in Parliamentary Road Maggie, and often went into Tyler's shoe shop for shoes for school !!
14th Jun 2006, 08:15pm
my great grandmother lived there but was around 1900
14th Jun 2006, 09:22pm
I think a wee bit before my time Maggie
15th Jun 2006, 07:05pm
yes i gathered that lol u would be over 100
16th Jun 2006, 06:00pm
I was born in Parliamentaty Road in 1929.
Ma maw couldny get a hoose
16th Jun 2006, 06:05pm
By the way people
Its no Garngad any more !!!! it is Royston and Roystonhill !!
16th Jun 2006, 08:06pm
It's been Royston Road and Roystonhill since 1942 but people still said Garngad. I never knew it as Garngadhill or road but my parents did.
28th Jul 2006, 04:53pm
I have recently come across another website which contains a lot of information about the old Garngad. It is the homepage of the recently deceased Robert McLaughlin. In order to see the website you should do a GOOGLE search for
ROBERT MCLAUGHLIN HOMEPAGE GARNGAD
28th Jul 2006, 05:35pm
Thank you very much for that information, will go and try it out.
28th Jul 2006, 08:27pm
Hello guys aand Gals
My late wife was a KELLY' and by a strange coincidence her mother was a ' MC CORMACK'
They wete fron Bishiopbriggs ,
.I was baptized in St Rochs School in 1931 .My mum lived in Parliamentary Road ,where i was born in my Grannies house.
MyGranda lived in Rhymer Stret as did many aunts and a few cousins .
My auntie was married to willy Lilly .Although, I speny all of my early
Anothe Aunt was my auntie Nelly . who married Eddie Fitzpatrick
I was born in Parlianmentary Road in my Grannie'house.in 1929.
I was baptizes in St Rochs in 1931 ( another story to be found) on this great site
Most of my early life was in Cowcaddens Cowcadens before movining up here to Bishopbriggs (among the toffs )Best of luck yours Tommy
29th Jul 2006, 01:33pm
I loved your story about being christened both ways. A real Glasgow story.
Tommy, there are too many Kellys in this world!
Kelly is the 2nd most common Irish surname. Murphy is the most common.
In fact, Kelly is the most common Irish surname found in Scotland.
If I am recalling correctly, Kelly is the 38th most common surname in Scotland.
McCormick is a Scottish surname, originating in Argyll.
McCormack is an Irish surname.
My McCormick greatgreatgrandparents came to Scotland from Donegal, Ireland in 1864. I know they were illiterate as they signed their childrens' Scottish birth certificates with crosses.
I am sure their real surname was McCormack but their surname was recorded incorrectly by officials on arrival in Scotland. In fact, nearly all Irish McCormack immigrants to Scotland had their surnames recorded in the Scottish form of McCormick.
The McCormack surname is very common in eastern Donegal. There are also a few McCormicks in Donegal, but they are descendants of the Scottish plantation of Ulster in the early 1600s.
I am going on a bit. I think I should introduce a new topic about Irish surnames in Scotland.
29th Jul 2006, 01:42pm
Just to let you know that I read through that site by Robert MC Laughlin and thoroughly enjoyed it.
At the beginning when he is mentioning characters--I remember so well my parents talking about these same people, and one or two names I recall myself as he came into his own era.
He has left a wonderful wealth of information for future generations of his family and seemed an extremely nice person.
Thanks again for bringing my attention to the homepage.
22nd Aug 2006, 10:17am
The GOOGLE search for
ROBERT MCLAUGHLIN HOMEPAGE GARNGAD
is no longer working.
In order to see the website you now have to do a GOOGLE search for
THE GARNGAD HERITAGE THE UNPUBLISHED WORK
You will come across articles written by 3 gentlemen about the
Robert McLaughlin, Ronnie McDonald and a Mr F G Locherty
23rd Aug 2006, 03:10pm
In 'The Garngad Heritage, The Unpublished Work', Robert McLaughlin says he remembers that one of the families that stayed next to him at Tharsis Street in the 1940s was the Collins family, and that he thinks one of the Collins boys was convicted of murder in later life. I recently came across a book in a bookshop here in Gaborone called 'Hugh Collins - Autobiography of a Murderer'. The book is about convicted murderer, Hugh Collins, born in Royston (Garngad) in 1951. It is the story of the archetypal Glasgow hard man. The Gorbals had Jimmy Boyle. The Garngad had Hugh Collins. The book won't be everyone's cup of tea and the language is very strong.
Collins describes his early years growing up in Royston (Garngad) and his teenage years as a member of the Garngad gang - The Shamrock - of which he claims to have been a founding member, aged 15, along with his friends 'Wee' Joe Mulligan, Joe 'The Bear' Devlin and Albert Faulds.
He gives a vivid description of Glasgow's street gangs of the 1960s:
The Shamrock (from Garngad), The Cumbie (from Cumberland Street, Gorbals), The Calton Tongs, The Bridgeton Spurs and The Maryhill Fleet. He describes how he was stabbed and slashed, aged 15, in a gang fight against The Cumbie, and again, aged 18, in a gang fight against The Tongs. He explicitly describes his gangland life which continued into his 20s and which ended ultimately in tragedy. In 1977, Collins was convicted of the murder of William Mooney, whom he stabbed to death in a Glasgow bar. Collins was released from prison in 1992 and nowadays lives with his wife in Edinburgh.
The early part of the book has a lot of info on Garngad in the 1950s and 1960s. Chapter 1 of the book starts as follows:
I'm five and a half years old, attending St Roch's Primary School in Glasgow. The teacher, Miss O'Donnell, has asked us each to stand, walk to the front of the class, and tell the others what our fathers do.
'My da's a railway worker,' says one, and sits down.
'My da's a postman. He delivers the mail.'
It's my turn, and I walk to the front with some pride.
'My da,' I say, 'is Wullie Collins. He's like Robin Hood. He takes from the rich and gives to the poor. My da's a bank robber.'
The class erupts, shrieking with laughter. I'm immediately embarrassed. Miss O'Donnell is taken by suprise. That's the end of that exercise, and my Granny is summoned.
'He's not a bank robber, Hughie. You mustn't say that. You musn't ever say that.'
So who had told me? Did I get the idea from Ginger McBride?
I guess you will have to buy the book if you want to read more.
23rd Aug 2006, 10:46pm
Might just huv a get a copy of that!
Might be worth a wee looky here, if yer missed it. The link is good as of time of posting.The Garngad Heritage, The Unpublished Work
30th Aug 2006, 08:45am
In 'The Garngad Heritage, The Unpublished Work', Robert McLaughlin and Ronnie McDonald both write affectionately about a man called Big Willie John Monaghan. Even Hugh Collins in his autobiography makes a warm reference towards him. I am sure Big Willie John must have been a well known character in the Garngad area in the 30s, 40s, 50s and 60s. I was wondering if you knew him.
I have also been meaning to ask you if you knew a Glen or Glenn family from the Garngad. They would have been distant relatives of mine through my McCormick ancestors.
All the best,
30th Aug 2006, 12:33pm
My grandmother was a Mc Cormack until she married my Granda
30th Aug 2006, 12:58pm
Willie John Monaghan is a name I heard a lot of while growing up in Garngad. Do you know if he was related to the Romeo family? If so, then I do know who the person is--I didn't know him personally though.
I was brought up in Rhymer Street but knew such a lot of people from the "Road"
Many of the names mentioned in the webpage, I have heard my parents speak of. Rosie Romy as she was known as, lived two closes away from my grandmother in Villiers Street. I don't remember the woman myself but I knew her grandsons through school and living in the area.
Can you tell me where the Glenn family lived Paul?
How I dearly wish I had seen that Garngad site before Robert McLaughlin died, there are a few questions I would loved to have asked him.
Thank you for bringing it to my attention.
My cousin's wife was brought up in Provanhill Street and I have printed out some of it to send on to her because she too will know many of the names.
I will ask her if she knew of a Glenn family.
In fact Paul, one of the articles there is about Hogmanay in the old Hibernian Hall, she and my cousin used to go there all the time when it changed to Royston Social Club, I was in it myself a few times.
Small world isn't it?
16th Sep 2006, 09:51am
The Glen family were staying in Bright Street at the time of the 1931 census but I don't know what happened to them after that. It is possible that they left the Garngad area in the mid 1930s during the 1st slum clearance programme as happened with a lot of Garngad families. None of my older living relatives seem to know what happened to the Glen family
16th Sep 2006, 10:45am
re-Glenn Family, if they left Garngad mid 30s then it's way before my time--I can't even recall my parents mention the name,this is the way I got to know about others from their era.
When I was at St Roch's Primary, I had a teacher called Mr Glenn, he lived in Stirling Road but don't know if his parents had ever came from Bright Street.!!
16th Sep 2006, 02:41pm
Thanks for that Valros. I wasn't suggesting for a moment that you were around in the 1930s! Sorry about that. I know that Sammy Glen and Mary Glen (nee O'Brien) were staying at Bright Street, Garngad with their young family in 1931. I thought you might have come across some of their descendants since you grew up in the Garngad area. Mary O'Brien (born Garngad 1891/92) was the daughter of Mary McCormick (born Bridgeton 1866), my greatgrandmother Elizabeth McCormick's younger sister. (See introduction to My Garngad Family History). Sammy Glenn was also born in Garngad around 1890 and his parents were Patrick Glen and Margaret O'Neill.
16th Sep 2006, 04:09pm
No need for apologies--I had a wee bit of a laugh when I read it though
Mind you, I am a bit "long in the tooth now !!!!
If I ever come across anyone who knew of a family called Glenn who lived in the area, I will let you know.
I will have another read at your history.
18th Sep 2006, 05:19pm
Someone mentioned a Monaghan. I went to school with a Mary Monaghan in the 50s and 60s who came from Roystonhill. Her best pal was Mario McHaffie and we all went to St. David's School in St. James' Road, Townhead. Does anybody know if she is related?
18th Sep 2006, 09:24pm
I don't remember Mary Monaghan from Roystonhill but when I was in Primary(St Roch's) there was a lad in my class called Albert Monaghan.
I don't know where in Garngad he lived but perhaps he was a relative?
3rd Oct 2006, 01:13pm
I have recently discovered from my dad's older sister Mary, who turns 80 next year, that Sammy and Mary Glen (nee O'Brien) had 3 children - John, Betty and Ina - all of whom must have been born around 1920. My Aunt Mary confirmed that the Glenns had been staying at Bright Street, Garngad in the early 1930s but she does not know what became of them thereafter.
My interest in the Glens started when I came across Mary O'Brien's death registration details on the net. (A married woman's death certificate is usually recorded under her maiden surname and the deceased's parents are also usually given.) Mary O'Brien - daughter of Willie O'Brien and Mary McCormick - died in Glasgow (district not specified) in 1987, aged 96 years. I already knew from the scotlandspeople website that Mary O'Brien had been born in 1891 at Turner Street, Garngad.
3rd Oct 2006, 09:37pm
It's amazing what you can find out on the net, isn't it?
It's a cert that my parents would have known the Glenn's from Bright Street because they lived next street in Villiers Street in the late 20s and early 30s, they moved to Rhymer Street around
in 1934 during what was called the slum clearance.
My Grand Mother lived in Villiers Street until the houses were being closed up and demolished.
I recall names of people that my parents spoke about and would you believe that a Lizzie Glenn was one !!! I don't know what street she lived in.
I had what was known as "old parents" Paul, my Mother was 40 before I was born so I can only go on names that I heard.
Wish I could help more
6th Oct 2006, 07:24am
paul.i have found the posts on garngad to be very interesting,especially robert mclaughlins web page.ithink everyone should do one just like it for future generations.
my family all came from the garngad.my father thomas coughlan,was born in 1910,at 4 villiers st,to thomas coughlan ,and margaret cahill.
my mother was barbara burnett,born1914 to stephen burnett,and barbara ingram,at 9 turner st.
they were married in st rochs chapel in 1931.their witnesses according to their marriage cert,were terence welsh,of 39 villiers at,and annie mc naughton,of 236 castle st.
i have often heard my mother speak of rosy romy,i believe her name was really romeo,and her maiden name monaghan.
all my relations resided in the garngad for a while,before being shifted to new houses in springburn, balornock, easterhouse,castlemilk,parkhead,etc,etc.
my fathers siblings.were james,and lawrence,katie,and agnes,and rubina coughlan.
my mothers siblings were,mary,betty,rose,and millie,tommy.and steve burnett.
it is a vey interesting subject...please keep it going.