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DannyH
I was in the company of three acquaintances, when out of the blue, one of them bellowed out,
"People who vote for UKIP are racists."

When I suggested to him that it is possible that the reason some people will be voting for UKIP,
is because it is a cry for help. Some of them may be living in areas where they feel that there is no immigration control, and none of the major political parties think this is an issue.

He nearly choked on hearing this.

Anybody got an opinion on this ?

It would be helpful to the debate if you would give your reasons for your opinion, in a calm manner.
Let's not start slagging off each other!!

Regards

Danny Harris
Dave Grieve
Although I can appreciate your call for a calm and reasoned debate, i think you have a better chance of the weather in Glasgow today changing to cloudless skies with 30c temperatures. Best of luck Danny
Betsy2009
I certainly think that some people who vote UKIP are racist and that some people within the party are racist.
However, that could be said for all parties.
Betsy2009
That was calm and reasoned, Dave, so can we have the good weather now please? Please?
ashfield
Danny, when you raised a similar question on the general election 2015 thread I posted this

QUOTE
Danny, I don't scoff at UKIP. The party was founded on one issue and one issue only, immigration, full stop. They had no policies in relation to the economy, NHS, employment, education, in fact all the important issues. UKIP is made up of a rag-bag of racists, sexists and power hungry zealots and, in my opinion, anyone taken in by them is a fool of major proportions.


I've not changed my opinion, only yesterday another UKIP candidate was dropped as a result of making racist comments (although it appears to be an almost daily event these days). As for those who vote for them, I don't think they would necessarily be racist but I still think they are foolish. That's because I believe they are being duped about the relevance of immigration in the greater scheme of what the most important issues are in the forthcoming election.
zascot
And you are not being duped by ALL the other parties. As someone else posted, Tories will create 2 000 000 jobs there are 1 600 000 unemployed therefore you will need 400 000 immigrants to fill the position. We can supply. yes.gif
mitchell
[indent][/indent]
QUOTE (zascot @ 2nd Apr 2015, 10:59am) *
And you are not being duped by ALL the other parties. As someone else posted, Tories will create 2 000 000 jobs there are 1 600 000 unemployed therefore you will need 400 000 immigrants to fill the position. We can supply. yes.gif


You can supply? We already overflowing with S.A migrants in Oz. rolleyes.gif
ashfield
QUOTE (zascot @ 2nd Apr 2015, 10:59am) *
And you are not being duped by ALL the other parties. As someone else posted, Tories will create 2 000 000 jobs there are 1 600 000 unemployed.


Zascot, I'm one of those who believes Cameron is telling the truth. The creating of jobs will of course only follow him doing a "Thatcher", and tripling the numbers out of work here through the Tory policies of constricting the economy rolleyes.gif
zascot
QUOTE (mitchell @ 2nd Apr 2015, 11:50am) *
[indent][/indent]

You can supply? We already overflowing with S.A migrants in Oz. rolleyes.gif

Your welcome. We got to improve both countries IQ levels in one swoop. biggrin.gif
Alex Saville
Danny

Can it be that those who vote for UKIP are fed up with the mainstream parties ignoring their opinions that they have decided 'My enemies enemy is my friend?'.
Another point is that the main parties such as Labour, Tory & Lib-Dem (Three of a kind!) had no great opposition in England, until UKIP, for voters to register their anger.
In Scotland, that's the SNP that serves that purpose.
As we saw in the Referendum, most areas that have voted SNP and sent MP's and MSP's to Westminster & Holyrood voted 'No'.
Now that the SNP is becoming a mainstream party, maybe they should be looking over their shoulder.

Alex
ktv
I don't think it would be fair to call ALL ukip voters or fans racists, they certainly have racists amongst them but I suppose other people who are not inherently racist will be taken in by their delusions and lies.

I don't think the SNP are "now becoming" a mainstream party either because they've been in government for years which would lead most people to believe they where the biggest party.
Jupiter
Im talking here about Scotland.From time immemorial Scots including my daughter have left to work abroad.I think its fair to say that it was mainly one way traffic.
Scotland was a small country on the edge of Europe,busy getting on with what we Scots got on with and in some ways quite non plussed with what others did.
Then Blair decided UK should be multi cultural,a political dig at the Tories.Since then and Im talking about Scotland the place has seen a massive influx of EU citizens ,illegals and asylum seekers.
The question is for me is this,"Did you prefer Scotland pre influx?"
If I answer yes and say I preferred my country before we had the above named coming here am I racist ?
On a personal level my situation hasnt changed but on many occasions particularly in hospitals Iook at other patients from all parts and wonder whathey contribute.Then I find myself being treated by an EU consultant and cared for by EU nursing staff .
As Jimmy Greaves said,"Its a funny old world."
rolleyes.gif
bilbo.s
It's really quite simple for many of us, Joop. We consider everyone we meet in life as an individual.
ktv
QUOTE (Jupiter @ 3rd Apr 2015, 12:12pm) *
Im talking here about Scotland.From time immemorial Scots including my daughter have left to work abroad.I think its fair to say that it was mainly one way traffic.



and there lies the irony of everything ukip stands for mate.

its ok for US to travel the world and live where we like but when others try and do it here is all the be off with you nonsense.
Billy Boil
QUOTE (DannyH @ 1st Apr 2015, 11:08pm) *
I was in the company of three acquaintances, when out of the blue, one of them bellowed out,
"People who vote for UKIP are racists."

When I suggested to him that it is possible that the reason some people will be voting for UKIP,
is because it is a cry for help. Some of them may be living in areas where they feel that there is no immigration control, and none of the major political parties think this is an issue.

He nearly choked on hearing this.

Anybody got an opinion on this ?

It would be helpful to the debate if you would give your reasons for your opinion, in a calm manner.
Let's not start slagging off each other!!

Regards

Danny Harris

The problem with political movements such as ukip. is that they start out with a platform that is largely made up of petty middle class property owners who do not wish to see said property devalued by an influx of people whom they perceive as being "foreign" in their aspirations and life style. Over time they will eventually be replaced and their institution hijacked by the rough end of the true "racist agenda" driven neo Fascists.

So although they indulged in "gentrified" and covert racism they find themselves trapped in a movement they initiated it has now become a rallying point for the "Mosleyites" still crawling around the dregs of the body politic.

The question must be put to them; will you protest the entry of white English speaking South Africans, New Zealanders, Australians, Americans, Canadians and even English speaking Dutch and Germans?
angel
QUOTE (Billy Boil @ 4th Apr 2015, 12:39pm) *
The problem with political movements such as ukip. is that they start out with a platform that is largely made up of petty middle class property owners who do not wish to see said property devalued by an influx of people whom they perceive as being "foreign" in their aspirations and life style. Over time they will eventually be replaced and their institution hijacked by the rough end of the true "racist agenda" driven neo Fascists.

So although they indulged in "gentrified" and covert racism they find themselves trapped in a movement they initiated it has now become a rallying point for the "Mosleyites" still crawling around the dregs of the body politic.

The question must be put to them; will you protest the entry of white English speaking South Africans, New Zealanders, Australians, Americans, Canadians and even English speaking Dutch and Germans?
angel
In general most Canadian's do agree with immigration , but in today's economic situation it might do well for the respective government's in power to curtail the amount of immigrants allowed into the provinces but not to stop it completely .

From what I have read , it is not the best of times for immigrant's to come to Canada and in all probability it's much the same in other countries.

Canada takes in about 250,000 immigrants on a yearly basis "at this time .." but unfortunately these immigrants are not able to find positions in the field in which they have been educated , so to my mind it is the Government that is to blame along with those employers who would pass over a perfectly well educated immigrant because , " dare I say , the colour of his skin " , Yes Racism and Bigotry raising it's ugly head .

It is truly a sad state of affairs when being interviewed for a job that a hopeful applicant has to deal with the mental baggage that their interviewer carries , immigrant or not .

I would say , that it is time for government's to put a quota on the amount of emmigrants being employed versus Natural born citizens.
RonD
If I may make some points as one who hasn´t lived in Britain many years. What is wrong with immigration when most of these people just want a better ay of life?They will work wherever they can to maintain a living and chance for at least their children to get ahead. It is a pleasant change from 3rd generation benefits natives who expect to be supported by the state. There is no black and white on this, there are genuine cases that need benefits and their immigrants that bring an agenda that is hostile to a UK culture. These always have to be sorted out. From what I am seeing that is causing animosity within the UK, Scotland and Wales want to be treated as a nation state whether within the UK or not but to rule their own country with their own country´s needs. This can frustrated by a London parliament that votes for the whole UK with a majority of English MP´s who are naturally England biased. I really think that England needs their own parliament to rule on truly English issues.
DannyH
Hello All

Without commenting on any individual response to my original post on this topic, I would like to make the following two comments.

1 - It is good to see that the discussion has not degenerated into a personal slagging match between
contributors, so far.

2 - It is however a bit disappointing that the discussion is developing into the pros and cons of the
UKIP party. That is a different issue.

The ISSUE is, "Is EVERYONE who votes for UKIP a racist"? My acquaintance asserted they are.

So let's have your views on UKIP voters (note the word, VOTERS).

Regards

Danny Harris

Alex Saville
No, they are not Racist.
Alex
Betsy2009
A racist is more likely to vote UKIP but they are not all racist. Some are just reacting to the media scaremongering.
Billy Boil
QUOTE (angel @ 4th Apr 2015, 09:27pm) *
In general most Canadian's do agree with immigration , but in today's economic situation it might do well for the respective government's in power to curtail the amount of immigrants allowed into the provinces but not to stop it completely .

From what I have read , it is not the best of times for immigrant's to come to Canada and in all probability it's much the same in other countries.

Canada takes in about 250,000 immigrants on a yearly basis "at this time .." but unfortunately these immigrants are not able to find positions in the field in which they have been educated , so to my mind it is the Government that is to blame along with those employers who would pass over a perfectly well educated immigrant because , " dare I say , the colour of his skin " , Yes Racism and Bigotry raising it's ugly head .

It is truly a sad state of affairs when being interviewed for a job that a hopeful applicant has to deal with the mental baggage that their interviewer carries , immigrant or not .

I would say , that it is time for government's to put a quota on the amount of emmigrants being employed versus Natural born citizens.

Dear Angel when you say " Natural Born citizens" I take it you are also including "First Nation Canadians" whose life style and conditions in Canadian society are often much worse than any migrants coming from overseas.
RonD
Is the UKIP racist? Like all political questions it is never black and white ( no pun intended). Without knowing exactly what the official mandate of the UKIP is, I´m assuming it wants the government to look after native British first before attending to incomers or sending large sums overseas to help foreign powers. It is possible to have this ¨charity begins at home¨ theory without being racist however, you have to know that some will take it to the next level and use it as a vehicle to wave their xenophobic issues and to raise their white power elements.
.
john.mcn
QUOTE (DannyH @ 4th Apr 2015, 10:30pm) *
The ISSUE is, "Is EVERYONE who votes for UKIP a racist"?


NO!

Farage brought up some relevant point thats the other parties want to brush under the carpet.
Anyone coming into the UK should have medical insurance to cover the length of their stay, if they dont have it then they get sent back. That may save millions of 's (farage said 2b but that includes EU citizens) because it will stop the NHS tourists coming here just to get treatment
he also commented on the freedom of movement, in the days before EU enlargement the members economies were pretty similar but with the inclusion of the poorer former eastern bloc anyone could see that there would be queues of people from there wanting to get to the better economies, well anyone but labour of course. This will continue until the economies of the member countries are roughly even, there should have been limits on the numbers allowed in based on the growth of their economy.
Without Farage there would not even be any discussion about migration, the cost and effects on peoples wages and areas that even the main party leaders now acknowledge.
Tally Rand
QUOTE (RonD @ 4th Apr 2015, 10:16pm) *
If I may make some points as one who hasn´t lived in Britain many years. What is wrong with immigration when most of these people just want a better ay of life?They will work wherever they can to maintain a living and chance for at least their children to get ahead. It is a pleasant change from 3rd generation benefits natives who expect to be supported by the state. There is no black and white on this, there are genuine cases that need benefits and their immigrants that bring an agenda that is hostile to a UK culture. These always have to be sorted out. From what I am seeing that is causing animosity within the UK, Scotland and Wales want to be treated as a nation state whether within the UK or not but to rule their own country with their own country´s needs. This can frustrated by a London parliament that votes for the whole UK with a majority of English MP´s who are naturally England biased. I really think that England needs their own parliament to rule on truly English issues.

The massive surge in migration after the second world war was mainly from dominions and colonies of the "British Empire".
These people, who for the most part considered themselves "British" and indeed many carried passports with the "British" coat of arms embossed on the front. They, in turn were treated with immense hostility on the part of the so called " Native British". This culminated in the Notting Hill race riots, inspired by a falling politician, Enoch Powell, who saw incipient racism as his path to power. Migrant from the colonies were used to fill the gaps left in a surging post war economy. They came from the West Indies, India, Pakistan and Hong Kong etc. and fitted largely into the "British ethos" going on to join the police and army, manning the health service and doing the jobs many saw in the U.K. as being beneath them. Their children went on to be M.P.s law lords and fill institutional functions in professions hitherto denied their parents. When immigrants are being condemned, and many of those immigrants are still subject to racist prejudice (if only on the colour of their skin); are those people being included or have they gained some "honorary British status" on account of their length of stay and contribution to what in the 60s and 70s was a booming international economy.

Are UKIP racist? From me a resounding yes.
lubbock
Do racists vote Labour or Tory.Do racists look and sound like your ordinary person on the .no matter who they vote for a racist will always be a racist get rid of all Muslim,Jewish.irish ,poles,Romanians ,Africans and your racist will still find someone,some race,to be racist towards.Say NO to racism..
Tally Rand
QUOTE (lubbock @ 8th Apr 2015, 06:34pm) *
Do racists vote Labour or Tory.Do racists look and sound like your ordinary person on the .no matter who they vote for a racist will always be a racist get rid of all Muslim,Jewish.irish ,poles,Romanians ,Africans and your racist will still find someone,some race,to be racist towards.Say NO to racism..

When my great grand parents first arrived in Glasgow they were subject to racist epithet and slept in the street under the big bridge. The lowland Scots treated them with disdain; and some still do to this day in spite of the fact that they gave name to Scotland and had been there for millennia.
Betsy2009
Don't think they'll vote UKIP
James Whyte's photo.
James Whyte's photo.
James Whyte's photo.
James Whyte's photo.
James Whyte added 4 new photos.
Betsy2009
Sorry - above didn't work and I couldn't cancel it.
Rab
Simple answer is NO. Immigration and racism are two entirely different things.
Just because you think unrestricted immigration is wrong does not make you a racist.

BTW. I think the UKIP is a joke. If Cameron keeps to his promise of a referendum and it votes for our removal from the EU then the UKIP will fade away.

This tiny UK island is bursting NOW with a huge population that cannot be properly housed and fed. I cannot see that we need any more immigrants. Does that make me a racist?
ashfield
I'm not sure what I would call those who would vote for a party whose leader has just said of the current crisis in Italy, we should take refugees (if we have to) as long as they are Christians wacko.gif
JAGZ1876
QUOTE (ashfield @ 22nd Apr 2015, 08:56am) *
I'm not sure what I would call those who would vote for a party whose leader has just said of the current crisis in Italy, we should take refugees (if we have to) as long as they are Christians wacko.gif



I would prefer Atheists myself. laugh.gif
Betsy2009
That's not a very christian attitude!
ktv
QUOTE (Betsy2009 @ 22nd Apr 2015, 09:56am) *
That's not a very christian attitude!


sadly the reality of it is....that it is the attitude of most Christians (the big shouty ones anyway)

the official religion of an indy Scotland would be rastafararianism anyway so who cares about the bothering biblists

you cant rule it out cause no one else has happy.gif
wombat
rolleyes.gif
bilbo.s
Brilliant, Wombat !
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