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> Common Irish Surnames In Scotland, Irish surnames commonly found in Scotland
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Paul Kelly
post 14th Feb 2007, 07:42am
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2 of Scotland's greatest ever sportsmen were undoubtedly 'Irish' Glaswegians Benny Lynch (1913-1946) and Jimmy McGrory (1904-1982).

Jimmy McGrory was the son of Donegal immigrants and was born and raised in Millburn Street, Garngad (Roysyon), Glasgow. His football career spanned the 1920s and 1930s and he spent most of it playing for Celtic. He scored 550 goals in first-class matches (still a British record), including 410 goals in 408 league games. Jimmy is the MOST prolific goal scorer in British football history. Amazingly, he was only capped 7 times for Scotland. (Several top Celtic players of this era had surprisingly few caps for Scotland.) Jimmy scored 7 times for Scotland keeping up his astonishing record of a goal a game in top-class football.

In my opinion, Scotland's greatest ever sportsman was Benny Lynch. Many boxing experts over the years have described Benny as the most talented British boxer of all time. Benny was the son of a Donegal man and was born and raised in Florence Street, Hutchesontown, Gorbals, Glasgow. He became Scotland's first ever World Boxing Champion in 1935 by defeating the reigning champion in Manchester. Amazingly, the city fathers of Glasgow Corporation refused to give him an official welcome home. Nevertheless, hundreds of thousands of ordinary Glaswegians spontaneously brought Glasgow city centre to a standstill in order to cheer Benny on his return to Glasgow from Manchester as the new World Flyweight Boxing Champion. People packed the streets all the way from Glasgow Central Station to his home in the Gorbals.

Benny's boxing carrer ended prematurely in 1938, aged only 25 years, because of his heavy drinking lifestyle. Tragically, Benny died in 1946 from the effects of alcoholism and malnutrition, aged 33 years. He will always be remembered affectionately by the people of Glasgow as 'Our Benny'.


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Paul Kelly
post 23rd Feb 2007, 07:19am
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McFall is an Irish surname originating in the Inishowen Peninsula of County Donegal. It seems that some of the 19th century Irish McFall immigrants to Scotland had their surnames recorded incorrectly in the Scottish form of McPhail.

In an earlier post it was mentioned that McKinstry is an Irish surname. McKinstry is in fact a Scottish surname originating in Galloway. The McKinstry surname is quite commonly found in east Ulster (particularly Antrim) and these Irish McKinstrys are descendants of 17th century Scottish Protestant Planters from Ayrshire and Galloway.

Smith is the most common surname in Scotland and England. It is also the 5th most common surname in Ireland. Many of the Irish Smiths are descendants of 17th century Protestant Planters from Scotland and England. However, some of the Irish Smiths are descendants of native Gaelic Irish families who changed their surnames to Smith (or Smyth) in the years following the Plantations when it was advantageous to do so.


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Paul Kelly
post 23rd Feb 2007, 10:05am
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Further to my post of earlier today, I have been reading a bit more about the Irish surname McFall. It seems that there are many McFalls in east Ulster (particularly Antrim) who are descendants of 17th century Scottish Protestant McPhail Planters. The Catholic McFalls of mainly west Ulster (Donegal/Derry) are not related to the Protestant McFalls of mainly east Ulster. (The original Irish Gaelic form of the McFall/McFaul surname of west Derry and north east Donegal (Inishowen) is O'Maolfabhail.) However, my earlier comment about some of the 19th century Irish McFall immigrants to Scotland having their surnames recorded in the Scottish form of McPhail still stands.
McFall, McFaul and McPhail all mean 'Son of Paul'.


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Paul Kelly
post 26th Feb 2007, 01:14pm
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Last year May I submitted 2 posts with 2 files included under the topic 'Have you ever been across the sea to Ireland?' in this Family History Forum: one was about My Family Tree and the other was about My Meenavoy Ancestors.

Over the past year new information about my ancestry has come to light and I have had to update these 2 files. So I am now going to resubmit these updated files.

The first file which I have copied below is called 'My Family Tree'.

I think I am now reasonably sure of the names of my 16 greatgreatgrandparents and where they came from. 7 came from County Donegal, 4 came from County Armagh, 2 came from Belfast, 2 came from the Scottish Highlands and 1 came from the Scottish Borders. The 11 from Donegal and Armagh were Catholics and the 5 from Belfast and Scotland were Protestants.

The second file which I have copied below is called 'My Meenavoy Ancestors' and it contains information about my ancestors from the Ballybofey/Stranorlar area in southeast Donegal (parishes of Stranorlar, Donaghmore, Convoy and Raphoe.)

Paul

----

File #1: My Meenavoy Ancestors

My greatgreatgreatgrandfather was Dennis (Dinny) Kelly of Meenavoy, Stranorlar, County Donegal. He was born c1795 and died c1865. Dennis had 2 sons: John (my greatgreatgrandfather) and Charles.

John and Charles married 2 sisters: Ellen (my greatgreatgrandmother) and Mary Jane Bonar from Callan, near Drumkeen, Convoy, Donegal. The father of Ellen and Mary Jane was Patrick Bonar/Crampsie.

John Kelly (born c1830) and Ellen Bonar (born c1840) had at least 11 children:
  • William Kelly (born 1861): married Mary McGlynn in Stranorlar c1883. They moved to Garngad, Glasgow c1884 and had at least 6 children.
  • John Kelly (1862): married and settled Glasgow. Died young (accident) leaving a daughter.
  • Patrick Kelly (born 1868): married and settled in Crossroads, Killygordon, Donaghmore.
  • James Kelly (born 1874): married Ellen Patton and settled in Magheracorran, Convoy.
  • Charles Kelly (born 1870): married Annabella Patten and settled in Tivickmoy, Stranorlar.
  • Dennis Kelly (1872): did not marry and settled beside his brother Charles in Teevickmoy.
  • Francis Kelly (born 1879): married Kate Doherty and settled in Tivockmoy, Stranorlar.
  • Joseph Kelly (*) (born 1871): married Mary Anne Tinney and settled in Meenavoy.
  • Ellen Kelly (born 1876): married James King (from Co Roscommon) and settled in Derry. Their son, Derry journalist Cecil A King, owned the Donegal Democrat newspaper for many years
  • Mary Jane Kelly (1864): married her 2nd cousin John Kelly (also from Meenavoy and the son of a Patrick Kelly) and settled first in Meenavoy and later Stranorlar. I understand their grandson, Peter Sharkey, is the owner of Sharkey's Bar in the Gorbals, Glasgow.
  • Hugh Kelly (my greatgrandfather) (born 1866): Moved to Glasgow c1886. Hugh married Elizabeth McCormick/McCormack in Glasgow in 1890 and they had 2 children. Elizabeth had grown up in North Lanarkshire and Glasgow and her parents had come from the Killygordon/Ballybofey area in Donaghmore, Donegal. My grandfather, James Kelly, was born in Garngad, Glasgow in 1895.
All the above had children except the unmarried Dennis.

Charles Kelly (born c1835) and Mary Jane Bonar (born c1845) had at least 7 children:
  • Anne Kelly (b1867):married William Ponsonby (^) from Tivickmoy and settled Convoy
  • Dennis Kelly (#) (born 1865): married Elizabeth Sweeney and settled in Meenavoy.
  • Charles Kelly and Mary Jane Bonar had 5 other daughters: Ellen (b1869), Catherine (b1870), Isabella (b1872), Margaret (b1874) and Elizabeth (b1876).
2 of the sons of Joseph Kelly (*), Bernie (b1898) and Frank (b1903), married 2 of the daughters of Dennis Kelly (#), Ellen (b1899) and Agnes (b1904). More examples of Kelly 2nd cousins marrying! Bernie and Ellen settled in Meenavoy and had 17 children. Frank and Agnes settled in Garngad, Glasgow and had 15 children.

Another greatgreatgreatgrandfather of mine was John Tinney (Tunny) from Meenavoy. John was born c1805 and died c1870. (I suspect John was actually born in Drumkeen, Convoy and that he married and settled in Meenavoy.)

John had at least 3 children: Catherine (my greatgreatgrandmother) (born c1840), Bernard (born c1841) and Susan (born c1850).

My greatgreatgrandmother Catherine (Kate) Tinney (born c1840) married Alan Rutherford. Alan came from near Lockerbie in the Scottish Borders and worked as a policeman in Stranorlar. Alan and Kate settled in Meenavoy and had at least 5 children:
  • Mary Anne Rutherford (born 1867) (married an O'Donnell)
  • Bernard (Barney) Rutherford (my greatgrandfather) (born 1869)
  • James (born 1871)
  • Catherine (born 1873) and
  • Patrick Rutherford (born 1875).
Bernard Tinney (born c1841) married Anne McBride from Dooish, Ballybofey and settled in Meenavoy. They had 6 children:
  • John Tinney (born 1869 and the first born) died as an infant.
  • Margaret Tinney (born 1878) died as a young woman and did not marry.
  • Mary Anne Tinney (born 1872) married Joseph Kelly (*) from Meenavoy and settled in Meenavoy. Mary died in 1901 and Joseph remarried Hannah Loughlin c1902
  • Catherine Tinney (b1880) married William Ponsonby (^) (a relative of the previously mentioned William Ponsonby) from Teevickmoy and settled in Stranorlar town.
  • Patrick Tinney (born 1871) married Catherine Gallagher from Roosky, Raphoe. They had no children and adopted a daughter.
  • Bernard Tinney junior (born 1874) did not marry and died in Meenavoy in 1945.
Susan Tinney (born c1850) married James Monaghan and settled in Meenavoy. They had no children.

My greatgrandfather Barney Rutherford (born 1869) married twice: firstly Mary Anne Bradley (my greatgrandmother) from Meenbane, Stranorlar and secondly Margaret Quigley from Cappry, Ballybofey. My grandmother, Sarah Jane Rutherford, was born in Meenavoy in 1899. After Mary Anne Bradley's death in 1903 and Barney Rutherford's subsequent marriage to Margaret Quigley and move to Ballybofey in 1904, my grandmother, Sarah Rutherford, was brought up in Meenavoy by Susan Monaghan.

The website 'Donegal Genealogy Resources' by Lindel Buckley has a copy of the 1901 Irish census for Meenavoy. Many of the above people appear in it.

The website also has a copy of the 1857 Griffith's Valuation for the parish of Stranorlar. The 1857 Griffith's Valuation lists the heads of all the households in County Donegal in 1857, parish by parish. My greatgreatgreatgrandfathers - Denis Kelly and John Tunny - are both listed in the 1857 GV for Meenavoy in the parish of Stranorlar.

Meenavoy or Meenavay is also known as Kellystown or Kellytown.

----

File #2: My Family Tree
  • Paul James Kelly (born 1971 Glasgow)
  • Martin Francis Kelly (born 1975 Glasgow)
Parents
  • James Kelly (born 1934 Garngad, Glasgow) (one of 7 children) (RC)
  • Ann Connolly (born 1937 Germiston, Glasgow) (one of 11 children) (RC)
Grandparents (4)
  • James Kelly (born 1895 Garngad, Glasgow) (RC)
  • Sarah Jane Rutherford (born 1899 Meenavoy, Stranorlar, Donegal) (RC)
  • Michael Connolly (born 1893 Clea, Keady, Armagh) (RC)
  • Sarah Lawson McKenzie (born 1896 Townhead, Glasgow) (PROT)
Great Grandparents (8)
  • Hugh Kelly (born 1866 Meenavoy, Stranorlar, Donegal. Moved to Glasgow c1886) (RC)
  • Elizabeth McCormick/McCormack (born 1863 near Ballybofey/Killygordon, Donaghmore, Donegal. Moved to Scotland in 1864 as an infant with her parents) (RC)
  • Bernard (Barney) Rutherford (born 1869 Meenavoy, Stranorlar, Donegal) (RC)
  • Mary Anne Bradley (born c1870 Meenbane, Stranorlar, Donegal) (RC)
  • Michael Connolly (born 1864 Clea, Keady, Armagh) (RC)
  • Bridget Rafferty (born c1865 Keady, Armagh) (RC)
  • Alexander (Sandy) McKenzie (born 1862 Inverness, Scottish Highlands) (PROT)
  • Elizabeth Lawson (born 1867 Belfast, Antrim) (PROT)
Great Great Grandparents (16)
  • *John Kelly (born c1830 Meenavoy, Stranorlar, Donegal) (RC)
  • **Eleanor (Ellen) Bonar (born c1840 Callan/Callanacor, Convoy, Donegal) (RC)
  • #John McCormick (born c1840 Ballybofey/Killygordon, Donaghmore, Donegal) (RC)
  • ##Rose Ann McArthur (or McEntyre) (born c1840 Donaghmore parish, Donegal) (RC)
  • Alan Rutherford (born c1830 near Lockerbie next to the Scottish Borders) (PROT)
  • ^Catherine (Kate) Tinney (born c1840 Meenavoy, Stranorlar, Donegal) (RC)
  • Patrick James Bradley (born c1840 Meenbane, Stranorlar, Donegal) (RC)
  • Mary Bridget Houston/Huston (b 1845 Lettermore/Magheravall, Convoy, Donegal) (RC)
  • Michael Connolly (born Clea, Keady, Armagh) (RC)
  • Annie Moan (or Mone) (born Keady, Armagh) (RC)
  • Bernard Joseph Rafferty (born South West Armagh) (RC)
  • Mary Short/Shortt (or McGirr) (born South West Armagh) (RC)
  • James McKenzie (born Wester Ross, near Inverness, in the Scottish Highlands) (PROT)
  • Jean Carmichael (born Inverness in the Scottish Highlands) (PROT)
  • William Lawson (born Belfast, Antrim) (PROT)
  • Ann Jane Davis (born Belfast, Antrim) (PROT)
Great Great Great Grandparents (can identify 6 of them)
  • *John Kelly's father was Dennis (Dinny) Kelly of Meenavoy, Stranorlar.
  • Dennis was born c1795 and died c1865
  • **Ellen Bonar's father was Patrick Bonner/Crampsey of Callan/Callancor,
  • near Drumkeen, Convoy. Patrick was born c1805 and died c1870.
#I think John McCormack's father was James McCormack from the Ballybofey/Killygordon area in the parish of Donaghmore.

##Rose Ann McArthur died in Garngad, Glasgow in January 1922 aged 81 years. Rose's mother was Margaret Kane from either Drumevish, Donaghmore or Gortletteragh, Stranorlar and her father was either Terence McArthur from Dooghan, Donaghmore or Charles McIntyre / McEntyre / McAteer from Sessiaghoneill, Donaghmore

^Kate Tinney's father was John Tinney/Tunny of Meenavoy, Stranorlar.


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big tommy
post 26th Feb 2007, 04:39pm
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Dear Paul
How very true / My surname is McSorley /My late wife was Kelly ,My mother was Mc Laughlin .My late moter in law was Mc Cormack .My sons wife is Hughes .
I suppose they all count .and all from Catholic immigrant families ,
y son in law is Malley I think they lost the'O' somewhre along the line
Tommy


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Paul Kelly
post 27th Feb 2007, 01:22pm
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Thanks Tommy.

I recently received an email from a Joe Kelly (born Donegal 1929) in Australia. It turns out that he is a 2nd cousin of my dad, James Kelly (born Garngad 1934). They have never met even though my parents stayed in Australia for 2/3 years in the late 1960s after they got married. The email contains an article written by Cecil A. King in the Donegal Democrat newspaper in 1972. Cecil King was born around 1905 in Derry and is a 1st cousin of my grandfather, James Kelly (born Garngad 1895, died Balornock 1970). Cecil was a journalist and was at one time the owner and editor of the Donegal Democrat newspaper.

The newspaper article is about the 'wake' of Frank Kelly (born Meenavoy 1878/79, died Tivickmoy 1972). Frank was the younger brother of my greatgrandfather Hugh Kelly (born Meenavoy 1866, died Gorbals early 1950s), Ellen Kelly (born Meenavoy 1876, died Derry early 1960s, mother of Cecil King) and Joseph Kelly (born Meenavoy 1871, grandfather of Joe Kelly in Australia). In fact, if you open the 'Meenavoy Ancestors' file which I attached to my previous post in this topic, you will see all the people I am referring to.

Meenavoy (Meenavay) and Teevickmoy (Tivockmoy) are neighbouring villages in southeast Donegal about 3 miles (5km) to the north of the town of Ballybofey, Stranorlar.

I found the newspaper article very moving the first time I read it. It is a tribute to the warmth, generosity, openness and friendliness of the people of rural Ireland.

Let me reproduce the article:

''THE HEART OF RURAL IRELAND

To be out of touch, as I am, with the life of rural Ireland, is akin to being ignorant of the finer senses of human values. This week, for the first time in years, I was at a wake. I never did like attending, or should it be participating in, 'wakes', but this time the deceased person was a venerable uncle, well into his nineties. At one time I had more than 20 uncles. This was the last of them and his death snapped the last link in a family chain going back over four generations. He was the youngest of a family of thirteen and when he was born in 1878, the eldest brother was 23 years old. They were the Kelly family of Tivickmoy, near Ballybofey, where there are still many branches, but the direct link has gone. Being at the wake was an experience. I was surrounded by relatives, from first cousins to cousins three times removed, many of whom I did not know existed. But that is not what I want to tell you about. What impressed me was the wonderful display of sympathy and respect for the dead. For three days the house never emptied, night or day. The people who came were from all arts and parts. They sat in the kitchen, in the parlour, everywhere in the house where there was a chair offered, and what a volume of reminiscing was indulged in. The Kelly family and its association with the life of the area formed the main theme of conversation, and, of course, none of them was like Frank, the quiet, genial, hardworking man, to whose memory they were that day paying tribute. One hundred years of local history was talked about while cups of tea kept coming with the regularity of a conveyor belt. Girls came from homes in the neighbourhood in relays to relieve and take over in this seemingly endless dispensing of tea and sandwiches. It would be interesting, I thought to myself, if the cups of tea could be counted. I hazard a guess and say they numbered five hundred. Everyone, it seemed, had to have one. I saw nobody refusing the hospitality. It all mounted up to a vast demonstration of the sense of neighbourliness that is innately in the Irish heart, and by that I mean the heart of rural Ireland, where real people are to be found. Would to God that this sense of mutual respect could have general application amongst all the people of Ireland. I left that house feeling edified by a manifestation of charity of the kind which I had thought was a thing of the past.''

By Cecil A. King (Donegal Democrat newspaper, 1972)


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rosie-k
post 28th Feb 2007, 09:20pm
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Hello Paul, I find this a very interesting subject, I have been tracing my roots with the help of Talking Scot, I now find I have loads of ancestors I never new of and my great great grandfather came from Killoe in Longford Ireland, he had 9 children, one was my grandfather who came to Scotland where he married my grandmother in 1908 they had 2 daughters(one of which was my late mother) he died in 1914 after a mining accident, I have been on a few sites about the pits and the way people lived in they days would break your heart, it makes very sad reading, they had it very hard in they days. I meant to say their name was O'shaughnessy. They stayed in Cleland in Lanarkshire, I have gathered a lot of information and photographs of their life'and photographs of the church they were married in, I also have birth and death certificates, as I said I find this fascinating, it is never ending but very enjoyable, I pick up loads of tips from the Talking Scot. I have just been having a look at all your posts---you have been busy.
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valleyboy38
post 28th Feb 2007, 10:54pm
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Paul Kelly i find your topic on irish names very interesting .I wish i could trace my ancestors . I know my name Traynor originates from Co Monaghan but i cant get by my grandfathers part as he and his wife died in the poor house in the Southeren General there my search stops .
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KiwiScoti
post 28th Feb 2007, 11:06pm
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All very interesting, many thanks.

My, weren't there a lot of Irish Immigrants into Scotland from the mid 1800's,
although, as you say, a considerable number would have moved on to the U S of A .

My Sweeney family were early immigrants into Glasgow.
My GG Grandfather gave his place of birth as St Andrews parish, Lanarkshire, ca 1808 .
I see from your posts that this was the only Catholic parish in Glasgow at that time.
He was married in Glasgow, by a 'Minister of Gorbals', Fr/Br James McLean, in 1830 .
He later lived at High Street and Drygate after returning to Glasgow, when pensioned.

As well as the navvies, miners, etc, many of the immigrants would have been enlisted into the British Army, as my Georgian/Victorian family were, for the few pounds bounty offered.

My GG Grandfather enlisted into the Highlanders at age 16yrs (for life) for the princely sum of Four Pounds Sterling, at Glasgow in 1825,
Attested by James Wingate esq JP of Lanarkshire, and he received ten shillings on being attested.

I would guess that many mothers pushed their sons forward for a bit of cash flow, when times were hard.

Even the Highland regiments had a large percentage of Scots-Irish, and Irish in their ranks.
Many of these settled in Glasgow on attaining pension, as my GG Grandfather did, after 1846.

My Gt Grandfather also enlisted, at age 11yrs, but there is no record of the bounty paid to him.
His four brothers all enlisted into the Highlanders as well.

cheers,
Sean
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Paul Kelly
post 2nd Mar 2007, 07:05am
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Hi Sean

I have been reading through your family history again in the topic
'A Glaswegian Scottish/Irish' started by you.

St Andrew's is the oldest Catholic parish in Glasgow, established in the very early 19th century, and it served mainly the earliest Irish immigrants to Glasgow. It seems your gt gt grandfather was born/baptised there around 1810. The 2nd oldest Catholic parish in Glasgow is St Mary's, Abercromby Street, Calton, which was established in 1842.

You said your gt gt grandfather married in the Gorbals in 1830. Was it a Catholic wedding? I assume it must have been, as in your family history you say your gt grandfather was baptised a Catholic in 1835.

I have recently been reading about Glasgow in the year 1836. The article says there were 2 Catholic churches in Glasgow in 1836:
St Andrew's in the old central area north of the River Clyde and a smaller 'temporary' church in the Gorbals to the south of the Clyde. No name is mentioned for this 'temporary' church, and it was later replaced by St John's, Portugal Street, Gorbals, which was established around 1846 (3rd oldest Catholic parish in Glasgow)

It seems your gt gt grandfather must have been married in this 'temporary' 1830s Gorbals Catholic Church. Have you any idea of the name of the church? Maybe it didn't have a name.

Paul


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Paul Kelly
post 2nd Mar 2007, 09:25am
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Hi Valleyboy.

You must be referring to the Govan Poorhouse.

I don't know how many poorhouses Glasgow once had but I have heard of 3 of them:
the Govan Poorhouse, the City Poorhouse in Parliamentary Road, Townhead and the Barnhill Poorhouse in Balornock/Springburn.

Poorhouses were in effect prisons for the very poor who couldn't provide themselves with the basic necessities of life.
A disproportionately high number of the inmates of Glasgow's poorhouses were destitute Irish immigrants.

Barnhill was the largest and most notorious poorhouse in Glasgow. It was completed in 1854 and could hold up to 2000 inmates. I remember my parents used to take me to visit my Granny Kelly in Avonspark Street, Balornock next to the Barnhill Poorhouse in the 1970s. The Barnhill Poorhouse building looked just like Barlinnie prison. I understand the building was knocked down in the 1980s.


Hi Rosie.

I agree that most of the Irish immigrants who came to the Glasgow and Lanarkshire had very hard lives. I don't think we really understand how tough their lives were.


Paul


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GG
post 2nd Mar 2007, 07:59pm
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Reply from Big Tommy:

QUOTE
Paul
The old Catholic church on the Broomielaw I.E/ St Andrews is now Glasgow Cathedral, the very heart of Catholcism for the whole of Lanarkshire and surrounding parishes.

We even had a Cardinal named REv Cardinal Thomas Winning. I met him a few times ,Twice when my pals 2 sons were ordinated in St Gregorys in Maryhill.

Then when he came up to my own parish at St Dominics in Bishopbriggs.

He was a lovely man and had he been spared , i think he might have been the new Pope.

Tommy

GG.


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RonD
post 3rd Mar 2007, 02:54am
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Anyone have an ancestor with the donegal name McNeilus, Mc Neillis or McNealus?


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matt.63
post 4th Mar 2007, 02:12pm
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I Lived in Avonpark st for a few years, was Barnhill the same place as Foresthall?


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danny bhoy
post 4th Mar 2007, 06:43pm
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Looking for anyone with the surname McGeever from Donegal, probably from the Ghaoth Dobhair area.
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