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> Uk Independence Referendum - Brexit, Yes or No on EU membership
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JAGZ1876
post 26th Apr 2019, 05:04pm
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"Both on the losing side in Governments that lost the argument and subsequently their majority with these two as leader"

Going by that logic every world leader will be a loser at some point Kem.
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JAGZ1876
post 26th Apr 2019, 05:08pm
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QUOTE (Dykejumper @ 21st Apr 2019, 10:41pm) *
Jagz has forgotten that 'Gnats' was a term devised by a fellow Nat.I wonder how he would describe
those SNP supporters who have been disgracefully attacking Flora Robertson.


What?

Is there any chance of you actually posting about the thread topic DJ?
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Kemedian
post 4th May 2019, 08:46pm
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My UK is European, so I'll be disappointed with us "IF" we leave.

Would I be disappointed enough to leave the UK?

I hope I don't get asked. I hope the economic argument for staying in the EU doesn't trump staying in the UK.

"IF" it did, I could be persuaded to rethink my 2014 vote.

The First Minister has taken the bait but why should Yessers get a second vote "IF" Remainers are refused their same demand?

"IF" the Prime Minister doesn't want to risk Scottish independence then give us another Brexit referendum.

QUOTE (Sturgeon @ 24th April, 2019)
IF we are to safeguard Scotland's interests, we cannot wait indefinitely.

That is why I consider that a choice between Brexit and a future for Scotland as an independent European nation should be offered in the lifetime of this parliament.


There's that word again... ... "lifetime".

unsure.gif
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ashfield
post 5th May 2019, 07:37am
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Sorry Ken, it may well be just me but, I have no idea what point you are trying to make.

Meanwhile in the English local elections, huge gains for parties supporting remain/second referendum. What do we get from the Tories and Labour, the public were telling us to get on with Brexit censored.png

If you ever needed evidence that the two main parties are at best deluded or (more likely) liars who are pursuing their own interests and agendas over that of the electorate, you now have it.


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carmella
post 5th May 2019, 10:51am
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I have often wondered how the Brexit vote was broken down by country. I think between Scotland, England, Northern Ireland and Wales, we can be pretty sure the bulk weight of that result was by England. If I could be bothered I would investigate further.


It must be a very worrying time for Brits who live part of their time for at least six months in any year, if Brexit goes through because they will only be able to spend three months at a time and three months back in the UK, Making it very difficult, also people with pet passports. Unless your family background qualifies you to apply for another passport within any European country!

Just a thought !

I am using my IPAD and I hate it, can’t beat a desktop.


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Kemedian
post 5th May 2019, 04:09pm
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QUOTE (ashfield @ 5th May 2019, 08:37am) *
Sorry Kem, it may well be just me but, I have no idea what point you are trying to make.

I find the word "If" very interesting in the First Minister's latest pronouncement.

I'm hoping that "If" never happens and I'm never forced into the dilemma of choosing between the EU and the UK.

I also think Sturgeon is a pragmatist by nature but she's playing a high-stakes game of chance in order to keep her Party together. A second EU referendum is edging nearer in my opinion, which she outwardly campaigns for but inwardly surely dreads, and that is the chance she's taken.

Over Easter, under severe pressure to act, the SNP leader chose to put all their eggs in the Brexit basket and, ironically, Westminster incompetence could be their undoing in the occurrence of another public ballot and vote to remain.

In case you can't tell, Ash, our First Minister has my respect in the light of her Brexit stance and, who knows, if Brexit doesn't happen and in following she drops her Party's pursuit of Scottish independence for a wee while, then if she survived politically she might even get my vote!

biggrin.gif
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ashfield
post 6th May 2019, 07:55am
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Kem, thank you for the clarification. “If” you don’t mind I’ll stick to the topic, although I accept that the “if” you refer to is about consequences.

I despair that so many people are sanguine despite the blatant lies emanating from the Tories and Labour, and right from the top of both. I did have to laugh though, at IDS blaming May and telling her to go. Who was it that came up with the debacle of Universal credit again rolleyes.gif

Given all the lies that have been told, the very least we should expect is a second referendum on Brexit, and I don’t mean some mealy mouth repackaging of the “back of a fag packet” deal negotiated by Westminster.


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JAGZ1876
post 6th May 2019, 09:42am
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QUOTE (ashfield @ 5th May 2019, 08:37am) *
Sorry Ken, it may well be just me but, I have no idea what point you are trying to make.


No, it's definitely not just you Ash.
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JAGZ1876
post 6th May 2019, 09:45am
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QUOTE (carmella @ 5th May 2019, 11:51am) *
I have often wondered how the Brexit vote was broken down by country. I think between Scotland, England, Northern Ireland and Wales, we can be pretty sure the bulk weight of that result was by England. If I could be bothered I would investigate further.


It must be a very worrying time for Brits who live part of their time for at least six months in any year, if Brexit goes through because they will only be able to spend three months at a time and three months back in the UK, Making it very difficult, also people with pet passports. Unless your family background qualifies you to apply for another passport within any European country!

Just a thought !

I am using my IPAD and I hate it, can’t beat a desktop.


If i didn't know better i'd swear that was a post from a Remainer Carmella. unsure.gif
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JAGZ1876
post 6th May 2019, 09:55am
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QUOTE (Kemedian @ 5th May 2019, 05:09pm) *
she's playing a high-stakes game of chance in order to keep her Party together.

who knows, if Brexit doesn't happen and in following she drops her Party's pursuit of Scottish independence for a wee while, then if she survived politically she might even get my vote!

biggrin.gif



No chance of May and Corbyn keeping their parties together though, and i doubt the FM will require your vote Kem. laugh.gif
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Kemedian
post 6th May 2019, 10:15am
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Labour's Watson and Starmer won't accept a Tory Brexit lightly unless there's another public vote attached, or so they say. They, unlike their ex-colleagues in the new Change UK Party, still hope to influence Euro-sceptic Corbyn to side with the majority of Labour Party members who are demanding a referendum.

This all spells trouble for the SNP, as I see it.

For as long as I can remember the SNP has been telling us that the Westminster system of Politics isn't fit for purpose. The Holyrood Parliament showed itself very competent after Scotland's referendum in 2014. Little did the SNP guess, however, that would set in motion a bid by the UK Government to settle the debate over EU membership...

The SNP are putting on a brave face, but their worst nightmare is potentially unfolding in front of them and so far the votes of SNP MPs are making matters worse. Westminster Politics could actually be on the verge of substantial change; something the SNP has always argued couldn't happen, and something that the SNP could arguably be responsible for.

Splits are appearing in the two main UK Parties around the issue of a confirmatory referendum, as if the first one didn't do enough damage.

Could it be, that all the SNP's hard work will bring down Westminster Politics as we know it? What a dramatic irony that would be.
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JAGZ1876
post 8th May 2019, 11:19am
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QUOTE (Kemedian @ 6th May 2019, 11:15am) *
This all spells trouble for the SNP, as I see it.


Wishful thinking, nothing else. yes.gif
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Kemedian
post 8th May 2019, 08:16pm
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Perhaps, Jagz.

But who envisaged this turmoil? Which Party had planning in place for current events?

Don't tell me the SNP.

MPs do not want to hand Brexit to its right-wing nationalist instigators, they'll sacrifice the system (and their reputations) before that happens, by refusing to back the deal and passing permission back to the people because it's the right thing to do.

And the SNP won't have a bad thing to say about it. Your Party may decry the apparent chaos, but it fears the eventual outcome that it can't avoid supporting, and that's a second Euro referendum.

Next time, MPs will be ready, but the Party lines will be alltogether rewritten.

Yes there will be unrest, and not just within Westminster! And who was it that first sought to tear up the status quo... ah yes, your Party, the SNP in 2014. In 2014 we were just 5% from disaster, then the madness spread South and the towers of London now teeter on the brink of Brexit.

This is the havoc of Nationalist Politics. We are in the grip of Brexit, yet your Party is at present screaming 'freedom' and demanding a whole new INDYREF! The only point in a second public vote is to overturn the unwanted result of the first, let's be honest about it. (There would be no public appetite for Indyref2 if the British public changes its mind about leaving the EU, far from it.)

I'm a Unionist, but get me out of here. Maybe Wombat will recommend a nice spot in the jungle for me. cool.gif
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JAGZ1876
post 8th May 2019, 10:50pm
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QUOTE (Kemedian @ 8th May 2019, 09:16pm) *
This is the havoc of Nationalist Politics. We are in the grip of Brexit, yet your Party is at present screaming 'freedom' and demanding a whole new INDYREF!



Well your "Nationalist Politics" has caused this impasse Kem, so what is your solution and why should the SNP disregard their raison d'Ítre when you British nationalists can't even agree on what you want?
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wombat
post 9th May 2019, 12:22am
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QUOTE (Kemedian @ 8th May 2019, 08:16pm) *
I'm a Unionist, but get me out of here. Maybe Wombat will recommend a nice spot in the jungle for me. cool.gif



rolleyes.gif erm tongue.gif england laugh.gif


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