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> Glasgow: Worst Schools In Britain?, City bottom of UK qualifications league
TeeHeeHee
post 23rd Sep 2011, 12:07am
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... and I had many a sore left hand to prove it. biggrin.gif


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"Destiny is a good thing to accept when it's going your way. When it isn't, don't call it destiny; call it injustice, treachery, or simple bad luck.”
― Joseph Heller, God Knows
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angel
post 23rd Sep 2011, 01:09am
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QUOTE
Do you think - based on your on experience - that Glasgow schools deserve to be placed at the bottom of the National league table ?

this , I understand was the topic of this thread which got lost practically at the start but as usual the so well educated testosterone took over,

George Whetstone, in Heptameron of Civil Discourses, 1582, wrote "The dashe of a Pen, is more greevous than the counterbuse of a Launce."

In Hamlet, 1602, Shakespeare gave Rosencrantz the line "... many wearing rapiers are afraid of goose-quills and dare scarce come thither."

Robert Burton's The Anatomy of Melancholy, 1621 includes "From this it is clear how much more cruel the pen may be than the sword."


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TeeHeeHee
post 23rd Sep 2011, 01:20am
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QUOTE
Robert Burton's The Anatomy of Melancholy, 1621 includes "From this it is clear how much more cruel the pen may be than the sword."

Which brings us back to the use of the pen ... in schools, which Glasgow schools have been noted to lack. wink.gif


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"Destiny is a good thing to accept when it's going your way. When it isn't, don't call it destiny; call it injustice, treachery, or simple bad luck.”
― Joseph Heller, God Knows
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angel
post 23rd Sep 2011, 01:33am
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Exactly , this is what the topic is all about ,"today's education " in Glasgow
not elsewhere .


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murphy
post 23rd Sep 2011, 03:32am
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Melody I know well what some of the people who seek freedoms in Scotland go through, you would have to live in a hole, not to realise their plight. But Scotland or Britain does not have the finances to help everyone who needs a home and money from the Government. I still think we need to help our own before we help others.
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GG
post 23rd Sep 2011, 07:44am
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QUOTE (Melody @ 20th Sep 2011, 11:33am) *
Easily Martin, take a well enough heeled area where parents are not beaten down by poverty and worry. Take those same parents who are able to retain 'normal' high ambition for their children. No specialised teaching required, no discipline problems, = Success. smile.gif

Yes, Melody, I would certainly strongly agree with you that the parental influence is very important in motivating children to get the most from education; I have also seen the debilitating effect poverty has on the aspirations of both parents and children, as I am sure you have too. That said, what still concerns me is the 'absolute' nature of the results we see in terms of pupil attainment.

As an example: at Jordanhill last year 45% of fifth year pupils achieved five Highers; at Springburn Academy (Glasgow North East) 0% of pupils achieved five Highers. I simply do not believe that – due entirely to 'background' effects – not one of the 200+ pupils at Sprigburn Academy was able to gain five Highers (a relatively modest achievement today considering rampant grade inflation). I think this disgraceful result needs to be explained to Glaswegians in terms of a more holistic consideration of all factors, rather than for authorities simply to just pass the blame on to environmental influences alone. What is happening in that school which is preventing pupils achieve their natural potential?

GG.


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kenb
post 23rd Sep 2011, 09:19am
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QUOTE (GG @ 23rd Sep 2011, 08:30am) *
Yes, Melody, I would certainly strongly agree with you that the parental influence is very important in motivating children to get the most from education ...

I went to kingsridge sen sec and waverley sen sec in drumchapel i got six o levels all b or above four highers all passes went on to stow college for civil eng on cert from a big family not known for brains it shows the right teachers the correct result give the schools back to the teachers. mad.gif


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WEY HEY
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Melody
post 23rd Sep 2011, 10:09am
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I agree Martin, it would be very interesting to hear the schools explain such complete failure. We do our young a massive disservice by not bringing all this into the open. Glaswegians deserve to hear why they are being failed by the whole system.
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Melody
post 23rd Sep 2011, 06:31pm
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How it used to be in 1960's. Stick with it.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p00jwr8g

It's not like this anymore. smile.gif
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GG
post 23rd Sep 2011, 07:51pm
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Thanks, Melody, I look forward to watching this over the weekend. I watched the first five minutes and heard how the Secondary Moderns resulted from the Butler Education Act 1944 (Scotland in 1945) which was "designed to break down class barriers". As we can see in Glasgow, that concept/objective is completely gone now, with children in huge swathes of Glasgow condemned never to achieve social mobility, except perhaps downwards!

If Glasgow does have the worst schools in Britain, then we are in trouble, because, according to news this week in that esteemed publication, the Daily Mail:

QUOTE
Britain 'has the worst schools in Europe'

A devastating attack on the state of Britain's schools has been launched by a distinguished international research body.

As pupils become the first in Europe to be sent home because of teacher shortages, the respected Organisation for Economic and Co-operation and Development warned that the system could face 'meltdown'.

At the same time literacy levels among young Britons are among the worst in the industrialised world, with one in three lacking the basic skills to cope with everyday life, it said. ...

Full story here:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-33...ols-Europe.html

GG.


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TeeHeeHee
post 23rd Sep 2011, 11:30pm
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QUOTE
It also measured the literacy skills needed to cope with everyday tasks at home or work ... Britain scored poorly on both counts. It trailed in 14th place in levels of absolute literacy - well behind countries such as Germany, Holland and Canada - and ranked 13th on the second list.

QUOTE
Topic : Diary of a Cancer Patient.
... I turned to see a teacher had joined us (quite right too! )
"He one of yours? Clever little begger aint he?"
"All my kids are clever" says he.

The teacher in question seemed more to be stating an accepted fact rather than simply bragging.


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"Destiny is a good thing to accept when it's going your way. When it isn't, don't call it destiny; call it injustice, treachery, or simple bad luck.”
― Joseph Heller, God Knows
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DannyH
post 24th Sep 2011, 12:05am
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If we turn the clock back to when I was at school from the mid 1930's to the late 1940's, there was full employment. Jobs were available for everybody leaving school who wanted to work.

In the Springburn area many, many boys learned a trade in the locomotive industry. Many of the girls worked in clothing factories or in shops. Some girls considered themselves fortunate to get employment in an office.

When we were at school, mental arithmetic was considered important because of the monetary system. There were 240 pennies to the pound and umpteen coins were in use. Many of the exam question consisted of a list of grocery items at different prices ranging from a farthing to a guinea.

So when the girls went to work in a grocers, they had a pencil behind an ear and would write down the price of all the items a customer had bought and then add it all up. Pity help them if they made a mistake. The customer would let them know!

What do girls and boys do now if they work in a grocers? They pass the items over the bar code reader and the total cost appears automatically. Now supermarkets have installed self-service bar code reader stations. They don't need so many employees.

And what about the boys? There is no major manufacturing industry in the Springburn area, or elsewhere in Scotland. Plenty of call centres though. The jobs many of we boys had required us to go to night school if we wanted to progress in life.

The decimal monetary system means that today's schoolchildren don't have to do the complicated calculations that were done years ago. Also, calculators and computers have removed any incentive for children to get involved in the mental process. Put it to the test. Ask a ten to twelve year old to calculate in their head, say 6x7x3.

Regarding English as a subject at school, I despair! Forget about deprivation. I have seen too many children from so called deprived areas on their phones, texting. The love of the English language is lost. In my opinion the reason for the poor results in English is that the children are just not interested. And why should they be? Texting is now accepted as the normal way of communicating. I know that from the number of people who write in the Texting language when they send me an e-mail via my computer. If I reply to them using capital letters at the beginning of every sentence, they send me a reply asking "Why are you shouting at me".

So to summarize, we can't compare the Glasgow education system of today, with that of the past. Everything has changed. If there is to be any hope in the future for your average working class child, we have to bring back jobs that give children an incentive to obtain. We also have to bring back the ethos of respect and responsibility. These have gone.
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TeeHeeHee
post 24th Sep 2011, 12:56am
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Danny says ..."Texting is now accepted as the normal way of communicating. I know that from the number of people who write in the Texting language when they send me an e-mail via my computer".

The difference Danny between gettin' a txt message from my kids, in their 40s, and their kids - teens to 20s - from England and gettin' a sims (short message service) from my German mates is incredible.
The txt messages from England have to be decoded and the sims have to be read with a cup of coffee nearby ... all written in full and proper hochdeutsche and no spelling mistakes with every noun having it's capital letter as the language demands.


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"Destiny is a good thing to accept when it's going your way. When it isn't, don't call it destiny; call it injustice, treachery, or simple bad luck.”
― Joseph Heller, God Knows
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tamhickey
post 24th Sep 2011, 01:38am
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There may be a couple of other reasons as to why the educational attainment of youngsters had fallen so badly. When Tony Blair's mantra of "Education, education, education" was first used, it held out a promise to young people that more University places would be offered, and that young people were to be valued. It was a noble idea, but came at a huge price. Yes, more people did go on to study at University, but as time went on it started to become clear that there were problems with this; too many graduates facing unemployment as too many were chasing too few jobs which led to a lot of emigration, lower starting salaries for those who stayed, (many having to take on internships prior to employment) fewer school leavers entering the workforce from school.
There were also associated problems with student loans and how they would be repaid and newspaper reports informing us of many graduate teachers being unable to find work. This, allied to the present recession which began in 2008 has left school students feeling there's not much point in working hard at school when they see no rewards in future. Smaller pensions and a longer expected working life are a real disincentive, especially when they see the money men from the banks, the City and speculators bailed out as the rest of us are told to suffer because of their failures.
It's no wonder that young people are disillusioned by their lot right now.
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Melody
post 24th Sep 2011, 08:43am
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Brilliant post Tam. Many varied reasons for this apathy in the poorer area schools.

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